Cat Food & Dachsies?

[Mrs.F]

We've always kept a bowl of dry cat food out in the kitchen for our 2 cats to snack on between their regular feedings of canned food. Penny has always nibbled a little bit, but prefers her own food. When she was sick (before the surgery) the vet asked me if she ever got into the cats' food. She said it's "too rich" for dogs and can cause pancreatitis. http://dachsie.org/ubb/eek.gif
Has anyone else heard this? I specifically asked my 'old' vet about cat food when we brought Penny home last March. He said it was OK, just make sure she didn't get too much or she'd have a weight problem. That was the ONLY health issue he mentioned. I switched vets last fall, after Penny"s seizure but the subject didn't come up until now. I'll do whatever it takes to keep Penny and Maggie healthy and happy, but I feel so badly for our poor old cats. I've put a bowl of dry food in the 'guest room' (where I keep the litter box since Penny moved in) because of the baby gate across the door. The food is on the other side of the room, but the cats won't touch it. They're 11 years old and just not up to jumping anything higher than a baby gate any more, so dry food on a table or counter's not practical for them. I'd sure like to put that little bowl of dry stuff on the kitchen floor again! Could Dr. Page be a little OVERLY cautious on this one? Anyone know for sure?

Heidi (and 2 desperately hungry cats)

[Penny's Aunt]

IN MY PERSONAL OPINION, a nibble here & there isn't going to hurt anything. But cat food IS higher in protein & fat than dog food, because a cat's body requires it.

And fat is usually the cause of pancreatitis, that is true.

If you're worried about it, you might try putting your pup on a low-fat dog food, so the cat food she eats probably wouldn't raise her total fat intake much higher than just regular dog food.

Check the labels on the foods.

Since a mini is about the same size as a cat, I don't know how you could fix a ground-level barrier that would exclude only the dog. If she is much larger than the cats, you might make a cardboard or wood panel barrier, & cut a hole in it just large enough for the cats to get through, & put their food behind it. But this works best with larger dogs.

Maybe someone else will have more ideas.

[Mrs.F]

Thanks for the good ideas Penny's Aunt.
My Penny is on California Natural after MUCH trial and error (she's pickier than Maurice the Cat) and I've been AMAZED at how glossier and nice her coat's been since we started her on it last fall so I don't think I'll look for lower fat food for her. (Maggie's still on Purina One for Puppies - that's what she ate when she was with Belinda. She eats everything in sight but is rather prone to loose stools. Since we're still working very hard on the housebreaking thing we'll stick to the Purina One for a little longer!)
We've tried all kinds of barriers to keep the dogs out and allow the cats easy access but not much success so far. My husband the handyman put lots of time and effort into a special gate with an opening large enough for the cats to slip through but too small for Penny's large chest and shoulders. HA! The cats wouldn't even attempt to go through and Penny managed to figure out how to get through it by pushing in one shoulder at a time....gotta get to that Kitty Litter! http://dachsie.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
We went back to the old baby gate but put a couple of books on the floor on either side to make the jump up and over easier on the felines. (Penny's small and not much of a jumper.) Then Maggie flew in from West Virginia and since she seems to be part kangaroo the books went back on the shelf....

[This message has been edited by Mrs.F (edited April 29, 2000).]

[Krista]

I have read that cat food can also cause liver/kidney problems because of the high protein content. I wouldn't take the risk if you think the pups might sneak more than a nibble here and there.

But, I tend to be conservative and very cautious. My thoughts usually are "why risk it?" when it comes to my pets.

Penny's Aunt's barrier ideas sound good, if your cats are skinnier than the pups.

[Penny's Aunt]

If Maggie is still having loose stools, she may be allergic to something in the Chow. And, since she has loose stools, anyway, you might consider changing her over to what the other dog is eating, BUT VERY GRADUALLY. If you can get rid of the loose stools, the housebreaking may be easier.

You've had a fresh stool checked for parasites at the vet? If not yet, try to get one that is less than 2 hrs old. Giardia (quite common) only shows up in fresh stools, & sometimes not even then; you may have to try it again if the loose stool continues. Giardia can be quite tricky to find (even in humans).

But overall, it sounds like you're practically working miracles with her. A stable home life may still take some getting used to!

[Mrs.F]

I really would like to switch Maggie over to the California Natural that Penny eats. She likes it but she's just 7 months old. I assume she should be on a puppy food until she's a year old?
Life would be much easier if both dogs ate the same food - could Maggie switch over (perhaps with a vitamin supplement or something?) Also, I hate the dog breath after Puppy Chow. I KNOW it's the food because I was SO pleasantly surprised when Penny stopped eating her Purina puppy chow and suddenly had nicer breath! She gets it back now and then now though, after nibbling out of Maggie's dish! http://dachsie.org/ubb/frown.gif

[Krista]

I would say that California Natural is a good enough food that you should try switching now. At 7 months, she really is nearly full grown since small dogs reach adulthood faster than puppies. If you want, you could just add a good vitamin supplement to the CA Natural once you get her switched over.

Purina Puppy chow has a LOT of corn -which has bascially no nutritional value and leads to higher stool volumes. (not to mention the other nasties it has in it.)

Rudy has been on FRR for all life stages since he was 7 or 8 months old and has been thriving. Many people say that if a food has quality ingredients and good vitamins and minerals that puppy formulas are really not necessary. Just remember to mix the foods for a week or so, so Maggie gets used to the CA Natural.

So glad that you are making such progress with her!

[Mandy]

As far as the cat food goes...it is true that dogs should not be allowed cat food. The higher fat content is very bad for the dogs. I remember this being a known problem even as a child (and we had one dog who loved cat food and one cat who loved dog food and they always wanted to switch).

Can you put a platfore on top of the baby gate so taht the cats only have to make it halfway at a time? I know they sell platforms that you can put on windows.....or even use a couple of those cat condo type things? (perhaps those are really expensive..I don't know)

[Pam C]

In my larger dogs I HAVE to take them off puppy food fairly early. As soon as a limp appear adult food all the way (their bones grow faster then the ligaments some time very painful and dangerous!) Normal around 7-8 months. They are though with the puppy spurt of growth and do nicely on a good adult food. And if it is the puppy food making her sick why use it!
As for cat food. It is bad also because it swells different then dog food. I had a dog eat a 5lbs bag of it (not a dachsie) and talk about pain! Her belly swelled up I thought it was bloat. I would have taken her to the vet but I was in Germany and had no clue where one was yet! And yes after she got better she would have gladly ate another 5 lbs! A nibble fot a dachsie is quite a bit, comparatively speaking.
I have to catch myself when I give treats to Xena. I wouldn't think twice about giving a nibble to my boy zoi, but it is almost the size of Xena's head! I can see how dachsies get overweight!

[Wienergal]

Heidi, another vote here against cat food for dogs. As someone else said, this is something I've been aware of for years--not sure where I learned it. But alas, since I don't have cats, I don't have any ideas for how to separate the food and keep the cats well fed at the same time.

But I would definitely switch Maggie over to the good stuff! You can add puppy vitamins (Foster and Smith sells 'em), If Maggie is the food hog that Farfel is, she might take a liking to cherry-flavored Tums, and you could give her one of those a day (break them in half) for extra calcium. I think the nutrition in the Naturals will more than make up for whatever puppy-boosters are supposed to be in the corn-y Purina! http://dachsie.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Mrs.F]

Maggie's scarfing up the California Natural and the cats are still turning their noses up at the dish of dry food in the guest room, but everyone seems healthy. I've finally decided that the cat kibble is far enough away from the litter box that that shouldn't bother them - they are just creatures of habit and want it where it always was. http://dachsie.org/ubb/frown.gif Poor babies. Thanks for the advice everyone - no more kitty food snacks for Penny or Maggie!

[Krista]

Umm don't know if this will work for you or not. I like to keep my office door open, but I don't want Rudy to go in there. A Baby gate would take too much effort to climb over, so I propped up a piece of board in the door frame. It is only about a foot high, so I can easily step over it, but Rudy has not tried to jump it. -of course there isn't food behind it. http://dachsie.org/ubb/smile.gif

Maybe you could put the kitty food in a box of some sort that the kitty's will jump into to eat, but that the dachsies don't. Just an idea.

Glad she likes the California Natural.