back problems/paralysis

[Bernadette]

I have just recently lost my best friend and 8 year old baby. I have had this breed dog since we got married 28 years ago. We have never encountered this problem. Sadie suffered total paralysis of her back legs after jumping from a chair. She had not suffered from any noticable symptoms prior to this injury. We opted to have her get the back surgery which was successful but she suffered aspiration pneumonia and a blood clot and died the day after surgery. Now we are questioning ourselves if this was the right decision. We also have a 9 year old rescue dachshund and I would appreciate any feedback as to help to prevent her from experiencing the same thing happening to her. Any suggestions and experiences would be welcome and helpful.

[mardoniche]

Hi Bernadette,
How sorry I am to hear of your loss. I am sure you made the right decision to have the surgery, it is so sad your little one didnt make it.
It is no good beating yourself up with if only, you had to make a very difficult decision, no one can know the outcome of our choices, except god maybe.
One of my dachsies injured her back, not long ago, and was paralised for a few days. I have been lucky, Gem is now mobile and enjoying her life, if a little slower than before.
I too was worried sick about my others, never previously having had any disc problems.
Apart from the normal precautions, all I now do with mine is give them vitamin C & E every day. I do hope that you will soon feel less sad,
Love to all those dachsies out there, Dawn and dachsies.:flower:

[dutchman]

Yes the what if trap is an easy one to fall into. We have to know we did what we felt was best for our little loved ones. Of course a loss can lead us to do more research so that we can learn if we could have done any thing different that would improve our chances of a happy outcome if we ever experience a similar problem with another companion.

Most likely surgery was the proper course of action to be taken with you little one. In some cases with a high degree of pressure on the spical column not doing surgey can be a death sentence for the dog. In cases of extreme pressure on the spine the animal many develop much more serious complications than just leg paralysis. Organ function can be deminished or even fail is the pressure is not removed form the spine. Lumgs, heart, liver kidney any or all of these may suffer or cease to function without the surgery. There can be cases of severe damage where surgery will not be of any help. In some cases of sever spinal damage the column itself can start break down. My neurologist said it's like the column turns to jelly (This was pointed out to me before making the final decision to do surgery). If that happens it is allways fatal. In those extreme cases suregery will not be of any assistance.

Now wilt a mild jnjury either from an accident or the effects of IVDD conservative non surgical treatment offtens results in full recoveries. The best we can do is place trust in the experts. Even experts can't be correct 100% of the time but we have to seek guidance from some place. Getting a referral to a neurological specialist who will do their own additional test before surgery (a milogram or cat scan) is a good idea in the case of a back injury. The faster sympthoms such as paralysis appear generally the more critical time is. A dog that goes from walking normal to complete paralysis in a matter of hours is more likely to suffer major damage than one who first starts to knucke it feet then progresses to a point of dragging themselves over a course of several days. Also many of the more critical cases will show that they are in a lot of pain. In the case of a major injury a difference of 6-12 hour in getting surgery can make the difference between a happy or tragic outcome. We are lucky and have the number two ranked vet teaching hospital (Colorado State University) right here in town (Fort Collins, CO). We also have Alemeda East Animal Hospital of Animal Planet Emergency Vets fame only about 60-70 miles away. My vet will send cases to both locations if they feel the animal needs more care than they can give. I think most of the local vets feel comfortable referring patients to the CSU VTH. I have little doubt that the resident who treated Aggie the little girl I lost cave her the best treatment possible. I know she was there many nightime hours running test trying possible treatments before we decided to help Aggie on her on her way to the bridge. Pre surgery Aggie was given about a 70-80% chance of a suscessful outcome. Whould I go to surgery again. Yes unless there was just no way I could finance the cost. Yes like you I ran up quite a bill. In general for most back cases you can figure at least $2,500-$3,000 if there are no complications. The VTH is forced by a State no compete law to charge the same rates a private vet in the area would charge for the same care.

Just remember learning and passing on information is good. Trying to second guess what we did can be damaging to ourselves and we all know our little departed companions wouldn't want us to beat ourselves up over their passing. With time it gets easier to look back on things. My What if trap is what if I had called my vet back when I found Aggie completely paraized the evening after our first visit. We had a followup visit scheduled for the following morning and I waited. By the time we got to the VTH abs someone was able to take a look at her (she was considered an emergency case) I had lost perhaps 18 hours. As I learned things both from my neurologist and from additional reading I know those hours might have made a difference in her outcome. I try not to let that beat me up I have to consider it a lesson learned.

The complication your litle one experienced are a ris that exists with mot if not all surgical procedures. It's one of those things that isn't that common but is there with even a very simple procedure. Don't let it scare you away from suregery on another animal in the future.

Tom

Tom

[Meemoo]

There's a new yahoo group that is strictly devoted to helping dachshunds who have gone down or are showing signs of back injury. The group is: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Dodgerslist/messages

and their website is:

http://dodgerslist.ourcresteds.com

which has a lot of helpful information.

[assisivk]

Dawn.... I have been lucky and not had to experience dealing with back problems with Willie, and now Diva. So I just don't know a lot about it, beyond what I've learned here on this board. Can you tell me more about the vitamin C & E?
Thanks.

[doxunzX3]

Don't be hard on yourself, if you did the right thing or not. I have had dogs in the past that have had back problems. But I haven't done the surgery. Then i felft quilty for not doing it. But the situation was with an older dog. Just going to the vets stressed her out. With my other dogs I was lucky and crate rest for 2-3 weeks allways fixed the problem with medication also.
We all make choices, then have to live with them. I choose to let my dogs go out in the woods and run and jump and hunt. It is always a chance something can happen. But things happen even just when they play. So don't be hard on yourself or overly protective. Each day we have with our little long doggies is a blessing and they always think we can do no wrong.
Except they thought I should feed them an hour ago!
:angel: Just think how gratefull your little Sadie is for all your efforts and loving thoughts.
Sandy & The Doxunz X 3

[assisivk]

Dear Bernadette,
First of all, let me apologize for being so unfeeling in my last message.... I asked a quick question and was gone... I did not tell you just how sorry I am. And for that I do apologize.

You really shouldn't be hard on yourself. It is hard to know.... and to play the "what if" card is always a temptation. In situations like this, I always think of my father which might sound weird. My father died 10 years ago. About 5 years prior to his death, he had to have triple by-pass surgery. He had always been an extremely active man... outdoors, on the water, involved with people etc. When my mother, sisters and I brought him home from the hospital, we were determined that we were prolonging his life and keeping him with us for decades to come. We catered to his every whim.... kept him in his recliner safe and sound... then allowed him to lead a "normal" though very quiet life. He got more and more depressed. Then summer came and we didn't let him out on his boat, no fishing trips, no cruising the lake with his friends.... and we couldn't figure out why he was depressed and just seemed so so sad.

Until the day he got mad at all of us and said that if this was to be his life, we might as well shoot him in his very comfortable chair... because it wasn't HIS life but one we'd scripted for him. Maybe okay for lots of others, but it still wasn't his life! I forgot to mention that he had a temper!

And we had to face up to some things... that he was not happy. He was not living his life. He wasn't doing the things that made him love life. And yes, there was a danger. But what did extra years matter if he was sad, depressed and lonely for his old life. As a family, we decided that we had to let go and let him live his life. And perhaps the five years that we did have him was shorter than it might have been... it was certainly a lot less than we wanted. But he was happy again, and he embraced life and he lived every moment.

And maybe it sounds weird to compare all of that to this time that you are experiencing. As much as we love these little creatures, they are dogs and there are things that dogs love to do that we may never understand.

I like what Sandy said here:
"We all make choices, then have to live with them. I choose to let my dogs go out in the woods and run and jump and hunt. It is always a chance something can happen. But things happen even just when they play. So don't be hard on yourself or overly protective."

Be sensible and watch out for them, but let them live and enjoy life. You make the best choices that you can at any given time and that is all we can do.

And again, I apologize for being so unfeeling in my last message.

[mardoniche]

Vicky,
From what I have researched, high doses of vit c and e helps to prevent or at least slow down, calcification of the discs. Which predisposes them to herniated discs. The high doses of these vitamins will certainly do them no harm, but may possibly help them. All mine are now on these vitamins, just in case they can help.
Dawn and dachsies.:bounce:

[oscarsmama]

Dawn,

I've heard of the vitamin c & e before but never tried it. Is this just regular vitamins like people take? How much do you give them? I'm very interested, one of my doxies had neck problems about a year ago and after a couple months of crate rest & prednisone fromthe vet he finally got better. I've thought about putting them on vitamins but I wasn't sure what kind or how much to give them.

Thanks, oscarsmama & Moose's too (Debbie)

[Opalowl]

Bruno, my standard male, who is six, recently had a laminectomy. That's the standard dachsie disc operation, and I have to say, he's never looked back. Following 'best practice' advice from the net (Sam Watson's page), we had him to the vet and then to the surgeon, within 48 hours. He was home after three days, and the day following his return home, he was out walking with us (on the surgeon's advice) and off painkillers. That was in May and already, if we don't catch him, he's hopping on and off things he shouldn't be.

We had always given him Cal C (Ester C as it's called in the US) on the advice of the chat line discusions, and because, we believed, it had such a positive affect on Rex, our dear old boy, who went to the Bridge in 1997.

However, the surgeon who did Bruno's back, who is meant to be one of the two best in Australia, says that it makes no difference at all. His comment was, 'if it makes you happy to give it to him, it won't hurt', but it won't prevent future problems, either.

I realise the jury is still well and truly out on this one, but Bruno had been having Cal C daily from the time we got him when he was four months old, and he still went down, quite young. We were lucky that we have a wonderful vet hospital here - and *pet insurance*.

Our surgeon says that backs are hereditary. Full stop. And try as we might, if we have dachsies, we're going to have back.s.

My tuppance...

[Bernadette]

:Thank you so much for the good advice. I have started giving my 9 yr old Marci Vitamin C and E. I think these will help since they do seem to help people. We just got a new 9 week old Dachshund puppy. She is a smoothe red and I will give her these vitamins. I want to give Sophie any chance to avoid this terrible problem back problem!!