Teaching the alpha it;s OK for the others to play

[dutchman]

Ok Guys put on your thinking caps. Tanner is my four leg alpha member. He allows Frank to initate play (wrestling or chase) with him most of the time and even takes the submissive role in that play. He won't let Dexter in on the chase games. Dexter wants no part of wrestling. Tonight we got out some old toys. I had a tug rope I dug out and started to play with Frank. Tanner got rather upset. Frank was tugging hard and using throat growls. I had to hold Tanner back so that Frank and I could play. At one point tanner wanted to take my end of the rope but both boys at that part started to use voices tha in the pase have been the first sign of a serious fight so I didn't let Tanner take the rope. I also found a string ball and was getting Dexter excited near the point of playing by rubbing his chest with the ball. He was getting excited and as he does he does when escited he had his mouth open and was doing some throatly growls. Tanner was ready to go into attack mode. When Dexter gets like that I'll gently tap his jaw and remind him no bite. I get a lick back and can even put a finger in his mouth safely at that point.

So how do you teach the alpha that it's OK for the other boys to play without getting him too upset and causing possible dominance agressin issues down the line? I'm open to suggestions. I was goign to sign Dexter up for some basic obedience classes but thought I could ask the trainer Tanner had for classes about this but discovered their training center has either gone out of business or moved. I need to find out which is the case and consider taking calss from one of teh other trainers in town. The great thing about the trainer I was seeing was that they were less than two miles from my home. Ther others that I know of are all closet to 10 miles away (almost a half hour drive in this town).

Tom and the boys (Frank, Tannet and Dexter)

PS as I was jsut about to hit the post button Tanner whi is laying in a bed near my feet told Frank in o uncertain works to stay away. No physical contact byt a voice I don't like he did respond to knock it off.

[Mark]

I guess my first thing is a question . . . do you think it is possible that Tanner believes he is alpha . . . even over you?

Second . . . don't allow it. We occassionally have similar situations with our alpha, Debbie . . . she finds out real fast that she is out of place. And she backs off.

Third . . . you as hooman alpha must support their pack order, under you and yet, maintaining that what you say, goes.. Have you been doing so with firsts, etc.? This doesn't seem to be an issue with our pack, but in most others . . . I believe it to be important.

I hope some of these thoughts help. Please keep us posted.

[dutchman]

Hi Mark,

I'm pretty sure Tanner see me as the overall pack alpha. I do try to respect his pack position but despite being the alpha he tends to hang back at treat time . He many times waits to take a treat till at least Frank has gotten his. Tanner is still my shy little shadow boy 99% of the time. The only times he is reluctant to obey me are when is is barking outside and when it is time to kennel. He seldoms kellels on his own any more. When I pick him up to kennel him his tail starts wagging very fast. I can take any treat right out of mouth at any time. He is a little difficult to displine since he seems to take any scolding very hard. He never challenges me when I do correct him and tonight when I put a hand on him so that I could play with the other boys that was all I really had to do to restrain him. Just reat a hand on his shoulders and tell hiim NO. He is my shadow boy and hates to out of site of me when I am home. I know if he wanders off it's time to check and see what is happening.About the only possible sign that he might consider himself above me are the times he will bark at me telling me i'm sleepin in too long or that Ihe really thnks it's time to eat. Even at those times if I tell him no he will settle down. While he generally sleeps near the foot of the bed if I pull him up to my chest and tell him it's his turn to get top dog sleeping positin against my chest he snuggles riht down and stays there all night.

It's hard to tell but sometimes I think because the other boys will use their voices at play time that he thinks they are going to attack me and that he needs to set then straight that that is not allowed and that they are below me in the pack.

As usual it's always hardest to analize your own pack. We can have a blind eye to things oyther can point out in a minute. I think one of the rasons I don't play with the boys more is because I've realized Tanner is not fond of that and I've just avoided the issue as a part of respecing hsis pack order. Frank loves to play so much and I think Dexter would also like to play so I would really like to find a way to modify Tanner;s behaviior without causing issues between him and the other two.

Tom and the boys (Frank, Tanner and Dexter)

I know it should be Tanner, Frank and Dexter but I figure Tanner can't read and I can use the order they boys arrived in my home.