Maggie is sick, sick, sick.

[Mrs.F]

Maggie has been losing weight for at least 8 weeks now. (You know the old ostrich syndrome - if I don't talk about it and pretend it's not really serious, maybe it won't be...)
Anyway, I first took her to the vet in late October. He couldn't find anything wrong with her, so we attributed the weight loss to emotional upset over all the fights she and Penny were having. She's been seeing the vet regularly since then, and has had all kinds of tests, but everything comes back normal. She's been treated for worms and/or other parasites and been on special diets and supplements.

Anyway, she's now down to 9.3 lbs. (She weighed 11.3 in September.) She looks pitiful, so thin and fragile, but she still plays, jumps around like a little kangaroo and sneaks up the stairs when I'm not watching, etc. and doesn't seem to be in pain. She's eating well (except that if she eats anything other than her normal dog food she gets terribly loose stools and may vomit). She has almost constant gas, but has a good appetite. Her urine and stools are normal.
Friday night she started having seizures. (Her seizures aren't as dramatic as Penny's. Lots of drooling, a thick bubbly saliva, and staring into space.) She seems to know that they are coming, and cries and wants to be held beforehand. They don't last very long, but she's not herself for hours afterwards. She just paces or sleeps, won't eat, doesn't want to be held. (She's had 4 that we know of.)
Dr. K drew more blood yesterday for another full work up. He's suspected that one or more of her organs are not working well for a while, but the x-rays, exams and previous blood tests have all been normal, so he can't pinpoint it. (We were kind of hoping it was diabetes - she drinks SOO much water, and at least diabetes can be treated - but that's been ruled out.)
I'm very scared now because she has this smell about her. It's hard to explain, but it's very similar to the smell of some of the very ill patients Penny and I visit at the nursing home. The vet techs assured me that many animals have a different, unpleasant scent when they are ill, but I'm afraid that this smell means something more.
The test results should be in tomorrow, and I am praying that some diagnosis will finally be made. Thankfully Maggie doesn't seem to be hurting, and she's home with us rather than at the vet's,(it's school vacation week, so she's able to spend as much time as she wants on someone's lap!) but I don't know what's going to happen.
She is so young - 15 months old, and as some of you remember she had kind of a rough start in her first home. It doesn't seem fair for her to be so sick now.
Heidi
PS She's seen several different vets. I trust Dr. K totally, but I've been so worried that I made an appointment with my sister's vet in the Boston area over Thanksgiving. He couldn't find any thing wrong with Maggie either. (He's the one that prescribed the special dog food. Maggie didn't do well on it though, so he advised me to switch her back to California Natural.) She's also seen the vets at the emergency clinic. They too did blood work and x-rays, and they too were normal.

[Meemoo]

I'm so sorry she is so sick. I hope she gets better real soon and that the vet can pinpoint what is wrong so she can have a happy healthy life.

Mega rayzzzzz being sent!!

Loren

[Mark]

Hi Heidi,

I am sad to hear that Maggie is so sick and that they (the Vets) can't seem to pinpoint the problem. I know that if the problem were identified, you'd at least know what to deal with and be prepared for . . . it's the not knowing that's hard.

Here in Michigan we are sending our very best Dachsie, Catahoula and hooman RAYZ & prayers your way.

Please let us know what the test results are,

Mark, Char, Top Spin, Duck Butter and Masse

[dutchman]

Hello Heidi,

We are sending some Colorado sunshine and dachsie rays your way. Not knowing what is going on is very difficult. IT sounds like you are doing your best to find a cause. Is there a major vet school any place close to you? Vet schools generally have more resources available to them to diagnose difficult cases. Can Maggie tolerate a little cottage cheese or yogurt added to her food?

Best wishes and rays,

Tom and the boys (Frank and Tanner)

[~Jen~]

Heidi,

Im very sorry to hear about Maggie i have been wondering about you guys! I hope that the vet. will finally be able to pinpoint what is wrong with Maggie and she can return to her normal playful self.

Sending TONZ of Dachsie Rayzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!! Your way!!!

Jen and the gang

[Mrs.F]

99% of the time there's nothing better than living in rural Maine......
We are just a few hours from Boston though, so depending on what we find out tomorrow I may call my sister's vet again to see if he can reccommend a specialist of some sort.

Thanks for the ideas to fatten Maggie up a little.... I'm sure that she'd gobble the cottage cheese right up, but her digestive tract is so sensitive right now that anything other than her normal dry kibble (California Natural) and plain water causes terrible gas, loose almost liquid stool and vomiting. Dairy products and eggs seem to be particularly hard for her to handle. (The emergency clinic gave us a little pamphlet suggesting eggs, cottage cheese or yogurt be added to the regular food to tempt an injured or ill pet and to help regain lost weight quickly.) We ended up going back to the clinic early on a Sunday morning for an anti-nausea drug.

One option that we've not tried yet but has been mentioned, is for Maggie to have no food or water by mouth for 72 hours (I think) and get all nourishment from an IV so that her digestive tract can "rest". This theory is based on the possibility that she's had some exotic parasite or virus that is gone now (hence the normal test results) but has left inflamation or damaged tissue behind.

[Dolly's Mom]

Oh my goodness! You must be frantic with worry. When I was reading your post (the beginning of it)I kept on thinking that it sounded like diabetes, but then you said that your vet had ruled that out. Oh, I hope they find what's up with Maggie very soon! I will send our finest N. CA doxie rays to Maggie hoping for her to get better soon.{{{{{{{<IMG SRC="http://dachsie.org/ubb/cwmsmilies/cwm38.gif" border=0>

Sending prayers to you too!
Sandi, Dolly and Maddie

[Oscar's Mom]

I'm so sorry Maggie has not been well. I know you must feel so helpless, but you are doing everything possible for her.
Sending lots of Get Well Rays your way!

[Mickamack]

Heidi,

I hope you'll be able to find a specialist in the Boston area. If not, there is Cornell in NY. I know they are one of the best in the country, but your regular vet would have to make arrangements for you to go there. Just another suggestion.

I'm so sorry that all of this is happening. You must be frantic with worry...I know I would be. Did you contact Penny's Aunt? She might have some additional insight.

Please keep us updated.

Karen

[Penny's Aunt]

Sorry I've been so busy I haven't had time to check in much. My Mom has been sick.

If the Boston vets can't find anything, or have any ideas to work on, I really would contact Cornell Vet School, even if only by e-mail, although a personal visit would be even better. I believe they only work from referrals, but that should be no problem. You vet would probably need to write out the whole deal in VetSpeak, since I'm sure he's simplifying his conversations with you.

They have a website where all their contributing specialist vets are listed, & your vet can e-mail most of them by clicking on their box. I thought I saved this site, but I don't see it now. I will try to find it again & put it in a follow-up post.

IMHO, I would start with what is causing the seizures. A lot of vets go right to a diagnosis of Idiotpathic (we-don't-know-what's-causing-it) Epilepsy, but since there are several other causes of seizures (or what appear to be seizures), all the others have to be ruled out first. Normal epilepsy doesn't cause weight loss & diarrhea.

More later if I can find it.

Good luck & Dachsie Rayzzz to you.

[Mickamack]

Heidi,

Here's Cornell's Web site. There are lots of things to look at on the site, including info on how to contact them
http://www.vet.cornell.edu/

If you go to Services and Extension, you will find the website for the animal hospital.

[Penny's Aunt]

I looked around in the website, but couldn't find the page of e-mail listings I was looking for.

But there is a consulting vet there that could maybe get your vet started. His name is Maurice White, DVM, who seems to be a veterinary diagnostician. He has his e-mail address posted for contact: mew6@cornell.edu

Good luck.

[Penny's Aunt]

When Maggie is at rest (not right after running, etc), could you count her heartbeats & respirations? How many of each in one minute?

[Mrs.F]

Maggie's test results are in. Her liver isn't getting the blood it needs to function properly. The odor and seizures are the result of toxins building up in her blood stream. I had to take her back in for another set of x-rays (with dye) and it seems that this is a congenital problem - she just doesn't have one of the major veins (or arteries - I was pretty rattled) that feeds the liver.
The nausea and diarrhea have something to do with her bile and the build up of toxins.... I have a whole list of questions that I'll take with me when we go in again in 2 weeks.
For now Maggie will be on medication and a special diet. In 2 weeks we'll do more blood tests and see how much the toxin levels have dropped and go from there.

Right now I'm pretty confused. I'm going to do a little research on liver ailments after I post this. I guess I'm better off tonight than I was last night, because at least we know what the problem is now. I'm frightened too, though. Even if there is some specialist that can do some miraculous surgery, how much will it cost? And is there already too much damage to her liver? Also, according to the blood work some of Maggie's other organs are are not functioning at their best - probably because they've been 'compromised' by the toxins in her blood. Hopefully they'll be no permanent damage to any other organs, but I don't know right now.

Keep those prayers and rays coming please.
Thanks, Heidi & Maggie

[dutchman]

More rays on their way from Colorado. Sounds scary but like you another area I would have to research.

Best wishes,

Tom and the boys

[Susan's Freddie98]

I'm confused here; you would think liver abnormalities would show up in ANY blood test, so why did the other blood tests come back normal??? I don't understand it.http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/frown.gif
I hope Maggie pulls through this, my thoughts will be with you both. Good luck.<IMG SRC="http://dachsie.org/ubb/cwmsmilies/cwm38.gif" border=0>

Susan

[~Jen~]

Sending TONZ and TONZ of MEGA HUGE Dachsie RayZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!! I hope Maggie gets better soon http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/frown.gif Our prayers are with you guys!!

Jen

[Mark]

Hi Heidi,

We're sending an assortment of our best RAYZ & prayers.

Please keep us posted,

Mark

[Oscar's Mom]

I'll keep Maggie in my prayers. I hope she is ok. Atleast you have some direction to go in now and your not at a total loss for what is wrong. Please keep us posted.
Debbie

[georgette]

Oh my gosh Heidi I had no clue having been so involved in rescue & the Queenie saga. These poor little kids seem to have such a tough time. Yes it's good that you finally know the cause, now what about the cure? Let us know what we can do - mostly I guess just keep her in our dachsie prayers which are always a need. So sorry and thinking of you during these days - Georgette

[Mickamack]

Oh Heidi, I'm so sorry to hear about poor little Maggie. The only comfort you can take is that now you know what the problem is and can start working on fixing the problem. I'm so glad that they were able to find out.

The liver? It's not something I would have immediately thought of, but it certainly sounds logical, the way you described it. I hope there won't be too much permanent damage to any organs, and hopefully, this will be something they can treat and Maggie can live a long and happy life with.

My thoughts are with you and if you need anything, just let me know.

Karen

[Dolly's Mom]

I'm sad to here that Maggie's condition involves her liver. I do hope the vet or hospital can help her. Sending massive N. CA rays your way!]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]


Sandi

[Penny's Aunt]

One BIG, BIG advantage the liver has that some other organs (like kidneys) don't have, is that it can regenerate itself.

Once your doctor does the groundwork, it may be to your advantage to ask for a referral to a specialist if your vet doesn't suggest it first. No one knows everything.

We are sending Dachsie & Belgian rayzzz to Maggie (Belgian rayzzz are just as good as Dachsie rayzzz, they're just a lot sillier!)

[Shelbie]

Tons of rays coming over from a frozen London, get well soon Maggie
With love
Debbie and Shelbie

[Mrs.F]

Maggie seems to like her new food - but then it's CANNED - Penny is quite envioushttp://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/wink.gif However, both dogs are acting like I'm mistreating them. The ever present bowl of dry food had to be put away because Maggie can't have any. Both dogs keep wandering over to that spot and nosing around forlornly. Maggie even sat politely and waited expectantly for me to replace the missing bowl!

Along with her special food (Hill's Prescription Diet) Maggie is taking an antibiotic (to protect the rest of her organs) and Metronidazole. I saw the healthy, spunky Maggie for a few minutes there while I was giving her the pills! She fought valiantly, but alas, she finally gave in and swallowed.

Susan, I too asked how Maggie's other blood work could have come back normal. There was really no reason to suspect liver problems so the first test was a more basic one, just checking her white blood cell count. The other blood tests were done right after serious bouts of diarrhea and vomiting, and Maggie had been off solid food for over 24 hours. That little rest and all the water Maggie drinks must have sabotaged the tests.
It was the fact that Maggie's lost so much muscle mass and the odor about her that finally tipped the vet off to test again after a normal meal and to do the x-rays.

[Dolly's Mom]

Can you give Maggie her pills hidden in a bit of cheese or in a blob of her new canned food? Madderoo gulps her new pill down without a backward glance when I put it in just a little piece of cheese. Of course Dollers wants a piece of cheese too. I just have to remember which one has the pill.
<IMG SRC="http://dachsie.org/ubb/cwmsmilies/cwm35.gif" border=0>

[Mrs.F]

I can get the tiny little amoxicillin pill into her with no trouble, but the larger, uncoated pill seems to stick. No matter how much I gently rub her throat it comes back out sticky and crumbly. Last night and this morning I gave her the amoxi pill plain but after a few tries with the metronidazole made a little Hill's L/D "meatball" with what was left of the pill in the center of it! I believe she'll be on these meds (or similar ones) for the rest of her life, so I really want to get that pill down by itself! Her appetite is good right now, but she goes through periods where I can't tempt her to eat anything. I guess I could just fight and force the pill down when those periods come, but if I can, I'd much rather get into a regular routine of popping the pills in, praising and petting then offering her food, so that I won't have the extra worry about meds when I'm worrying about her being "off" her food.
I'm hoping that the key will be MY getting better at popping the pill in quickly and having at land just far enough back to go down, but not far enough to gag her. She's always taken pills well (and she's taken more than her share these last couple of months!) - I've even bragged about it http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/blushie.gif. I think these are the first uncoated pills I've ever had to give her though. I know I hate the bitter taste of an uncoated pill on the back of my tongue!

Hey Dolly and Maddy - that cheese sounds yummy! Too bad Maggie can only have her special food for a while! http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/facelick.gif

<FONT COLOR="#00FFFF" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Mrs.F on December 30, 2000 at 07:59 AM</font>

[Mrs.F]

I posted a few questions about Maggie on the Dog Health Board at the PetSmart site and a woman named Kathy was really helpful. She described Maggie's condition to a T - it's called hepatic encephalopathy (and the vet probably told me that on the phone), caused by a portosystemic shunt. Once I knew the name for the condition I was able to go searching and find out more. I feel a lot better now. There is a surgical remedy if Maggie doesn't already have too much organ damage. Because it's a congenital condition, it usually shows up earlier than it did in Maggie, but once I started reading more, she has had many warning signs - we just didn't recognize them. Unfortunately, because the signs are so subtle - I got a lot of my info from sites where people that had just lost their dogs to this condition wrote in asking for more info. http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/frown.gif
Anyway, I know it doesn't matter in the long run, but I was really relieved to find so many descriptions of hepatic encephalopathy that said the condition is hard to diagnose. The hematology and blood chemistry test results are usually "unremarkable" and show only "subtle elevations" or "mild abnormalities". I'll always wonder if just one more phone call or one more visit to another vet would have gotten an earlier diagnosis for Mags, but at least I know that it's not odd that all those earlier blood tests didn't pinpoint the problem.
Now we'll just keep praying that she'll respond well to the medication and get those ammonia levels down.....

[Dolly's Mom]

It sounds like you've found a great site for good answers. That's great! Hope Maggie can have the surgery and it will be successful! http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

Sandi

[WOTANSMUTTI]

Heidi!

Sorry it has taken me this long to get to this thread!

Poor Mags- asked the vet for the pineapple or bubblegum flavored amoxicillan that you can administer by dropper. Liquid works best with cats and I asked for it when Wotan got bit by the coyote. They end up beatin' feet to the fridge... http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/facelick.gif

On the Animal Planet's Vets show I saw where this little dog had a liver like Maggie's.
What it was was a liver shunt, and they went in surgically and reconnected a better blood supply. I guess most dogs succumb to it when they are pups- but some live on until a few years then it pops up.


Hope Maggie is feeling better by today. Tomorrow is a new year.

<FONT COLOR="Red">HAPPY NEW YEAR'S MAGGIE & HEIDI & PENNY</FONT c>

[Roxane]

All this terrible stuff going on with Maggie and I had missed it until today.
Forgive me.
Our warmest best wishes for her medicine to bring her back to her usual self. Happy New Year, Maggie. Want to hear you are up and running for 2001.http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/bounce.gif
Roxane and crew

[Mrs.F]

I know that I have to be careful not to build up false hopes but Maggie seems to be doing wonderfully today. She went for a romp in the snow (and then took a 2 hour nap - she tires so easily now) and has been driving me crazy all afternoon looking for more food. She's so thin that I'd love to feed her all she wants, but she's limited to half a can a day for now so as not to overwork that liver of hers. She keeps looking for the bowl of dry food that's always sat next to her water dish, but alas, it's put away.

She had another mild seizure late last night and she's still got her distinctive odor, but all in all she seems better than she has in months. I so wish we'd known how to treat her sooner!

Heidi


<FONT COLOR="#00FFFF" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Mrs.F on December 31, 2000 at 02:00 PM</font>

[Susan's Freddie98]

Heide, I'm glad Maggie is feeling a little better, let's keep our fingers and paws crossed. Thank you for sharing the info on her condition. I will read up on hepatic encephalopathy later. I tried getting info the other night, but no luck.http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/frown.gif I'll tell ya, you never know what's down the road with our furkids!
May I ask what the little "warning signs" were previously? Is Maggie jandice at all?

Susan

[Mrs.F]

Maggie doesn't seem to be doing quite as well today.http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/sad.gif I hate to leave her tomorrow, but I'll have to go back to school. (If only I didn't teach kindergarten.....older kids would be THRILLED to have a substitute for a few days!) My husband is going to come home at lunch time to check on her and give her a few tablespoons of food, and my good friend Jane will pop in, too.

I got some encouraging news from 2 different Maltese owners today. (Liver shunt is to Maltese what back problems are to dachsies.) One woman has an 8 and 1/2 year old dog. He was diagnosed with a shunt about 6 years ago and they've kept him healthy and happy for all this time by controlling his diet. I also got a really informative email from someone cautioning me to insist on further testing - (my vet's office has already made the phone calls to get some further testing done in Portland). She claims that a huge number of dogs diagnosed with shunt actually have a different type of liver disease. Many end up in surgery only to find out that there is no shunt! Yikes! She gave me a good list of tests to look into and some questions to ask the vet.
I'm still frightened, but much more optimistic now!

[loving two dachsie's]

Maggie is in our prayers, Keep us posted on how she is doing.

Linda

[Wienergal]

Heidi, just want to add our R*A*Y*ZZZZ to the ongoing flow headed in Maggie's direction! We are keeping toes and paws crossed that the problem can be resolved and that Maggie is feeling better. It's wonderful that you've found a web site with so much information! How on earth did we all survive pre-Internet???

Many hugs from your Chicago friends....

[pluto'slanie]

Mrs. F, I too just got to reading this thread. I'm so sorry that Maggie isn't well, but now that her condition has a name, there is a possibility for treatment. Sending rayzzzz and prayers from Brooklyn, NY. Lanie, Pluto & Shana

[TessieMom]

Sending mega rayzzz to Maggie from Rena and the dachsie girls: Kibby, Tess, LuLu and Stinker.

[dutchman]

Heidi,

I hope things are at least stable for Maggie. We are awaiting an update any time you feel up to it. I hope the meds work out and this was caught in time. Having a sick little buddy is difficult.

Best wishes and rays,

Tom and the boys (Frank and Tanner)

[Tanya]

HI. I have been away for so long I had no idea Maggies was sick. I'll need to read about this liver shunt problem. I have never heard anything like this. When you can update us on how Maggie is doing. I'll say a special prayer for Maggie and send healing rayz your way.
Tanya

[mlam]

So sorry to hear that Maggie is ill - we hope she feels much better very soon. She sounds like a real sweetie!