Can back problems lead to arthritis?

[Maggie Aggie]

Maggie has approximately two more weeks of precautionary crate rest after injuring her back last month. Last week, she had some trouble with limping/weak legs, and I wonder if this is related to her back injury.

It started with her inability to put her weight on one of her back legs. Took her to the vet. He thought she twisted her knee and told me to keep an eye on her. She hopped around on 3 legs for a couple days.

Then she started putting weight on it again. Then her other back leg was weak for a couple days and she limped around on it. After a couple more days, her back legs regained their strength and she limped on a front leg.

She's fine now, and the strength has returned to all of her legs. (She hasn't limped at all in several days.) She never showed any signs of pain or discomfort--her legs just seemed to be weak. I'm puzzled.

Is this a normal thing for a dachshund recovering from back injuries? Or does this sound like possible symptoms of arthritis?

We will probably be taking a trip to the vets on Thursday (to get the anal sacs expressed http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/sick.gif), so I will talk to her vet about all this. I just wanted some advice in advance. Thanks.

Vicki

[Mark]

Hi Vicki,

I'm usure if Maggie's symptoms are arthritus, but we know that about a year after back surgery Duck Butter developed arthritus. It is especially noticable in cold, damp weather. Masse, who had the spinal infarc a few years back has no arthritus.

Probably the best answer is to talk to the Vet.

I'm no help . . . am I? http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/lol.gif

Mark

[Maggie Aggie]

Mark,

How did you realize that Duck Butter had arthritis? What were her symptoms? Does she take meds when it acts up?

It's a very damp day here today (but not cold), and Maggie is limping on a front leg again after not limping for at least four days.

Vicki

[Mark]

Vicki,

The most noticable symptom is that she walked very stiff legged with unsure footing and (when a particularly bad day-damp & cold) she shakes (shudders) in waves. It is clear she is in pain when it happens, but she never makes a peep. The Vet gives us Rimadyl which works most the time, but sometimes between doses we give her 1/2 baby aspirin which always works within about 30 minutes.

From your description it is possible that Maggie has arthritus or simply hasn't fully recovered from her back injury. Once she has fully recovered from the injury, will likely tell the tale on the arthritus.

Please keep us posted,
Mark

[dutchman]

Mark since I noticed in another thread that you mix in food and supplements with Glucosomine & Chondroitin I'm a little surprised you haven't suggested their use here. They are great supplements for arthritis. I mix AVO-Maintenance with AVO-Derm to get them into my boys diet as a general joint health supplement.

One other possibility as to what is going on here is over user injuries occurring in the different legs as Maggie tried to compensate for the original knee problem. This is very common in people where they try to compensate for an injury and end up stressing other areas creating new problems.

Good luck,

Tom

<FONT COLOR="#00FFFF" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by dutchman on February 14, 2001 at 02:22 PM</font>

[Mark]

Hi Tom,

I claim temporary insanity! http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/lol.gif

You're right . . . those are important supplements for arthritus prevention and I do apologize, Vicki, for not having mentioned them earlier. I may have been on my phone headset when posting to this thread, but it's important and should be mentioned.

We feed all the kids a 50/50 mix of kibble and canned food. The kibble does have both Glucosomine & Chondroitin and it is Nutro Natural Choice. The canned food does not, it is Nutro Max. The Glucosomine/Creatin supplement is called Synovcre (I think) and is a chewable tablet that Duck Butter & Masse view as a treat. They each get 1/2 tablet, twice a day.

Thanks Tom,

Mark

[Maggie Aggie]

Thanks, Mark and Tom.

I've been meaning to talk to the vet about putting Maggie on a glucosamine supplement, but with everything else going on, I always forget. I'll do that tomorrow.

I appreciate the input from both of you. I'll let you know what the vet says tomorrow. Thanks again.

Vicki and Maggie

[Maggie Aggie]

The vet thinks Maggie's current problems are related to the back injury.

He watched her walk around for quite a while and felt along her spine. He decided to go with more meds and 6 more weeks of crate rest. I agree with this, because I believe we have to eliminate the possibilty that the problem is related to her back. The symptoms do sound similar to arthritis, but I guess time will tell if it's her back or the beginnings of arthritis.

We also have started her on a glucosamine/antioxidant supplement. He encouraged me to take her for short walks on level ground to keep her strength up. I think that will help, but I'm concerned with her mental outlook too. More time stuck in an ex-pen with nothing to do but rest sounds rather grim to me, so I'm sure she's not going to like it either. I can't even give her any toys because she plays too rough.

This is just so frustrating. Please keep the rays coming.

Vicki and Maggie

<FONT COLOR="#00FFFF" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Maggie Aggie on February 16, 2001 at 02:27 PM</font>

[dutchman]

Hi Vicki,

It sounds like you have a good vet. With Maggie's relatively mild symptoms additional crate rest and meds sounds like a good conservative approach. She didn't have any of the rapid onset sever symptoms that generally indicate the need for emergency surgery. Are there any long lasting chewies that she might enjoy and not get too active with.

Best wishes and rays,

Tom and the boys (Frank and Tanner)

[Maggie Aggie]

I do give her the occasional Nylabone or (if supervised at all times) a rawhide stick, but she's an aggressive chewer and nothing lasts very long. I'll have to do some more shopping and see if I can find something for her.

Thanks for the rays, Tom.

Vicki and Maggie

[Mark]

Hi Vicki,

First the RAYZ http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/rayz.gif http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/rayz.gif http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/rayz.gif http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/rayz.gif

The Galileo chews last real long and the 4" rollups (rawhide) are too.

Get well soon, Maggie!

Mark

[Maggie Aggie]

Maggie finished the Robaxin this past weekend. We still have Rimadyl left over for when she needs it. I have not seen an improvement in her, but she is not worse either.

She has done very well on the daily walks. They seem to help loosen her up, and I can tell that she enjoys them. But, she is still stiff and has trouble pulling herself up to stand after she lays down for a while. She's in obvious pain in the mornings, so I'm still giving her Rimadyl.

I've tried to be patient and wait for her to get better, but I can't stand seeing her in pain all the time. I want to know exactly what we're dealing with here. What is the best way to determine whether we are dealing with a lingering back problem or arthritis (or even something else)? X-rays? I'm assuming that's it, and I am planning to take Maggie back to the vet this week to get them done.

Are there any other tests that I should have done? At this point, I don't feel that we know exactly what's going on with Maggie. Just two months ago she was completely healthy.

Vicki

[TessieMom]

Hi Vicki!
I was going through some old messages from CTDR and came acoss a website you might find useful:
http://personal.inet.fi/cool/sll/
More rays, Rena and the girls

[Maggie Aggie]

Took Maggie to the vet today to get some x-rays and answers. The lateral view didn't show much. Her discs seemed to be fine--no signs of compression. Everything looked normal. The dorsal view, however, showed calcification bridges across several vertebrae. The vet never used the technical term for this, but I believe it is spondylosis.

He told me to continue walking her but try to avoid running and twisting around. She can have Rimadyl as needed. If she gets worse, he will recommend an orthopedist.

I guess I'm kind of relieved with this diagnosis out of all the possible things we could have been facing. Her spine itself looks good, but I know this is something we will have to deal with for the rest of her life.

Does anyone have any experience with spondylosis?

[Jmom]

My Dane got extensive spondylosis starting at 9 months of age. For several months, he would scream in pain upon the simplest of movements (I was ready to commit us both to an insane asylum). After a few months his pain was much relieved. The vet said it was because as the vertabra were "bridging" (fusing themselves) they would rub together so were painful but once bridging was complete, he was stiffer (which was good in his case as the reason the spondylosis was happening was because his spinal column was unstable, so the fusing stablized things) but with less pain. My poor Fred ended up with a huge hump in his back from this. But his was unusually severe...

Sounds like Maggie isnt' going through anything that extensive. I don't know how old she is but my vet also told me that most if not all dogs over the age of about 7 have some degree of spondylosis. Many never even show any signs or symptoms.

I'm sure, like with arthritis, any pain Maggie may have from it will be readily controlled with meds. Fred had it so bad, and went on to live a pretty normal life, didn't slow him down too much at all.

Good luck...I know how it is to see your baby in pain but I'll be Maggie will do just fine.

[Heidismom]

Hi, all! My response doesn't have abything to do with spondylosis, but it is on a lighter note, and sometimes you need a smile or a laugh! Years ago, dachsie #3, Fritz (my only male - a b/t mini) had twisted his right front foot. After it was well, he apparently enjoyed the family's attentions so much, that he would forget which foot had been hurt, and limp on the left to get a bit of TLC! Heidi, Gretl, and Siglen's mom, Julia

[Maggie Aggie]

http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/lol.gif http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/lol.gif http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/lol.gif I can definitely appreciate that story! Maggie would be quite capable of doing something like that. http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif

As for an update, Maggie is completely back to normal--full of energy, running around, and looking for new ways to get in trouble. She hasn't even needed any Rimadyl in the past couple days. Nothing at all has changed since our vet visit on Thursday, so I'm puzzled about her recovery BUT I'm also very, very thankful for it. http://dachsie.org/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif

We're going to continue our walks and keep gradually increasing the distance. Hopefully keeping her active and keeping her positive will prevent a reoccurrence of whatever it was that had been bothering her for the past several weeks.

<FONT COLOR="#00FFFF" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Maggie Aggie on March 04, 2001 at 11:42 PM</font>